info@ffbc.groups.io

Re: November Ride Calendar

Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...>

#346

Update to the November Calendar

Rob Tashjian stepped up to the lead the November Monday MMRR rides on the 5th, 12th and 19th. I still need a ride leader for the Monday MMRR on the 26th.

I also need a ride leader for the Women's Sunday Social Ride on the 25th.

Thanks and ride safe.

Dennis Dong

Show quoted text

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 7:23 PM Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:

Greetings members!
The holiday season is closing in on us! Things to note:
1) For those of you who have the Cycliq Fly12 and/or Fly6 cameras, there is a town hall meeting on Nov 1st at the Castro Valley Library (3600 Nobridge Rd, CV) from 6:30-8:30 pm. This will be a round table discussion regarding the use of video footage and prosecution of suspects in assaults and drivers in accidents, questions and/or issues with the camera systems, etc.
2) The opening of Calaveras Road is once again delayed
3) Starting Nov 17th, a section of Morrison Canyon Rd will be closed to vehicular traffic but open to pedestrian and cyclists (according to an East Bay Times article)

It's that time again to ask for members to take up the role as ride leaders for the rides needing one. I need ride leaders for the following rides:
SUNDAY, 11/26 : Women's Social Ride
MONDAY : MMRR

Will the existing ride leaders please check the calendar for any needed corrections/additions and let me know.

Thanks and ride safe,
Dennis Dong
Ride Coordinator

Re: November Ride Calendar

Andrew Sass

#345

The road never looked so good. Alameda County portion has been completely repaved and they are finishing striping today. Smooth fresh pavement!

It was posted as being closed to November 2, so there is a good possibility it will be open for our first Saturday of the month Calaveras ride.

Andy

Show quoted text

On Saturday, October 27, 2018, 7:33:23 AM PDT, Ken Goldman <ken.goldman@...> wrote:

Yes, from the south you can get to the fence at the False Summit. Club ride going there today.

Ken

On Oct 26, 2018, at 10:53 PM, Tim Wong <mistertimwong@...> wrote:

Thanks for the info, Dennis.

Does anyone know if Calaveras is still open for cyclists from the south side up until the reservoir?

Thanks,
Tim

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 7:23 PM Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:
Greetings members!
The holiday season is closing in on us! Things to note:
1) For those of you who have the Cycliq Fly12 and/or Fly6 cameras, there is a town hall meeting on Nov 1st at the Castro Valley Library (3600 Nobridge Rd, CV) from 6:30-8:30 pm. This will be a round table discussion regarding the use of video footage and prosecution of suspects in assaults and drivers in accidents, questions and/or issues with the camera systems, etc.
2) The opening of Calaveras Road is once again delayed
3) Starting Nov 17th, a section of Morrison Canyon Rd will be closed to vehicular traffic but open to pedestrian and cyclists (according to an East Bay Times article)

It's that time again to ask for members to take up the role as ride leaders for the rides needing one. I need ride leaders for the following rides:
SUNDAY, 11/26 : Women's Social Ride
MONDAY : MMRR

Will the existing ride leaders please check the calendar for any needed corrections/additions and let me know.

Thanks and ride safe,
Dennis Dong
Ride Coordinator

SHORT NOTICE RIDE: Sunday 8:00 Mt. Diablo Metric

Colin Moy

#344

Anyone interested in quick jaunt up Mt. Diablo, meet at NORTH parking lot of Pleasanton BART 0800 hours (8:15 rolling) and coffee/pastry at Denica Livermore.

Please RSVP so I know to wait for you.

Colin

510-690-7749 cell

Show quoted text

---------- Original Message ----------
From: Ride with GPS <info@...>
To: moyboys@...
Date: October 27, 2018 at 8:17 AM
Subject: Colin wants you to see a route on Ride With GPS

Hi Colin!
Your friend Colin just shared this cycling route with you, so you know it must be a good one. It’s 64.6 miles long, with an elevation gain of 4,958 feet. Take a look for yourself and then saddle up!
Mt. Diablo 100K
Does this ride have your name written all over it? Why not give Colin a shout and go ride!
Why purchase a premium account?
Ever forget to turn off your Garmin on the drive home? Ride Clean Up lets you adjust your data so your buddies won’t think your top speed is 70 mph.
Keep track of important stuff in your bike maintenance log.
Just find a route, claim and customize to your preferred starting location, Smart Sync your Garmin, and saddle up.

We hope to see you soon on the trail or on Ride with GPS!
Enjoy your ride.
The Ride with GPS team
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2222 NE Oregon St, Suite 210, Portland OR 97232

Re: November Ride Calendar

Amy

#343

South to the false summit! Still open!

Amy

Show quoted text

On Oct 26, 2018, at 10:53 PM, Tim Wong <mistertimwong@...> wrote:

Thanks for the info, Dennis.

Does anyone know if Calaveras is still open for cyclists from the south side up until the reservoir?

Thanks,
Tim

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 7:23 PM Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:
Greetings members!
The holiday season is closing in on us! Things to note:
1) For those of you who have the Cycliq Fly12 and/or Fly6 cameras, there is a town hall meeting on Nov 1st at the Castro Valley Library (3600 Nobridge Rd, CV) from 6:30-8:30 pm. This will be a round table discussion regarding the use of video footage and prosecution of suspects in assaults and drivers in accidents, questions and/or issues with the camera systems, etc.
2) The opening of Calaveras Road is once again delayed
3) Starting Nov 17th, a section of Morrison Canyon Rd will be closed to vehicular traffic but open to pedestrian and cyclists (according to an East Bay Times article)

It's that time again to ask for members to take up the role as ride leaders for the rides needing one. I need ride leaders for the following rides:
SUNDAY, 11/26 : Women's Social Ride
MONDAY : MMRR

Will the existing ride leaders please check the calendar for any needed corrections/additions and let me know.

Thanks and ride safe,
Dennis Dong
Ride Coordinator

Re: November Ride Calendar

Ken Goldman

#342

Yes, from the south you can get to the fence at the False Summit. Club ride going there today.

Ken

Show quoted text

On Oct 26, 2018, at 10:53 PM, Tim Wong <mistertimwong@...> wrote:

Thanks for the info, Dennis.

Does anyone know if Calaveras is still open for cyclists from the south side up until the reservoir?

Thanks,
Tim

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 7:23 PM Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:
Greetings members!
The holiday season is closing in on us! Things to note:
1) For those of you who have the Cycliq Fly12 and/or Fly6 cameras, there is a town hall meeting on Nov 1st at the Castro Valley Library (3600 Nobridge Rd, CV) from 6:30-8:30 pm. This will be a round table discussion regarding the use of video footage and prosecution of suspects in assaults and drivers in accidents, questions and/or issues with the camera systems, etc.
2) The opening of Calaveras Road is once again delayed
3) Starting Nov 17th, a section of Morrison Canyon Rd will be closed to vehicular traffic but open to pedestrian and cyclists (according to an East Bay Times article)

It's that time again to ask for members to take up the role as ride leaders for the rides needing one. I need ride leaders for the following rides:
SUNDAY, 11/26 : Women's Social Ride
MONDAY : MMRR

Will the existing ride leaders please check the calendar for any needed corrections/additions and let me know.

Thanks and ride safe,
Dennis Dong
Ride Coordinator

Re: Morrison Canyon

Tony DD

#341

I thought so but, I wasn't in the position to argue.

I saw a couple riding casually in the blocked street right before I entered so, i assumed it was ok for cyclists.

Show quoted text

On Friday, October 26, 2018, 11:06:57 PM PDT, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

Well the police officer was wrong in stating that a bike is a vehicle.

But s/he may have been correct in blocking access. Depends on what the ordinance/resolution for the parade states. Once a street is officially closed, CVC effectively no longer applies.

Practically speaking, parades and other special events are highly stressful for police. I’d cut them some slack, there.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 22:13, Tony DD via Groups.Io <iamhippo@...> wrote:

I guess it depends on what and how its posted?
I rode in the zone that was blocked for the Fremont parade and the Fremont PD threatened to give me a ticket saying the street was blocked for all vehicles and stated the bike is a vehicle. This was at the corner of the Stevenson/Paseo Padre by the Fremont library this year.
I was only trying to get home.

On Friday, October 26, 2018, 9:35:55 PM PDT, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

If the sign says that the roads is closed to “vehicles”, but doesn’t mention bicycles, it’s open to bicycles. Because bicycles aren’t vehicles in California.

That was the original question being asked.

That said, the sign could be wrong. I haven’t read the text of the actual ordinance for the road closure.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 21:07, Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:

I'm not sure what this discussion turned into. Yes, a bicycle is not a motor vehicle, but under CA VC 21200(a), a cyclist has to follow the rules of the road (including stop signs)

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 20:58 Glenn Kirby <gkirby@...> wrote:
They are not Motor Vehicles. Bicycles are regulated in California under the Vehicle Code

On Oct 26, 2018, at 8:47 PM, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

Bicycles are not vehicles.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=670.
This is why municipalities have to explicitly forbid sidewalk riding by ordinance. CVC 21663 does not apply to bicycles.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 13:24, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>

Re: Morrison Canyon

Andreas Kadavanich

#340

Well the police officer was wrong in stating that a bike is a vehicle.

But s/he may have been correct in blocking access. Depends on what the ordinance/resolution for the parade states. Once a street is officially closed, CVC effectively no longer applies.

Practically speaking, parades and other special events are highly stressful for police. I’d cut them some slack, there.

Show quoted text

On Oct 26, 2018, at 22:13, Tony DD via Groups.Io <iamhippo@...> wrote:

I guess it depends on what and how its posted?
I rode in the zone that was blocked for the Fremont parade and the Fremont PD threatened to give me a ticket saying the street was blocked for all vehicles and stated the bike is a vehicle. This was at the corner of the Stevenson/Paseo Padre by the Fremont library this year.
I was only trying to get home.

On Friday, October 26, 2018, 9:35:55 PM PDT, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

If the sign says that the roads is closed to “vehicles”, but doesn’t mention bicycles, it’s open to bicycles. Because bicycles aren’t vehicles in California.

That was the original question being asked.

That said, the sign could be wrong. I haven’t read the text of the actual ordinance for the road closure.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 21:07, Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:

I'm not sure what this discussion turned into. Yes, a bicycle is not a motor vehicle, but under CA VC 21200(a), a cyclist has to follow the rules of the road (including stop signs)

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 20:58 Glenn Kirby <gkirby@...> wrote:
They are not Motor Vehicles. Bicycles are regulated in California under the Vehicle Code

On Oct 26, 2018, at 8:47 PM, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

Bicycles are not vehicles.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=670.
This is why municipalities have to explicitly forbid sidewalk riding by ordinance. CVC 21663 does not apply to bicycles.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 13:24, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>

Re: November Ride Calendar

Tim Wong <mistertimwong@...>

#339

Thanks for the info, Dennis.

Does anyone know if Calaveras is still open for cyclists from the south side up until the reservoir?

Thanks,

Tim

Show quoted text

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 7:23 PM Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:

Greetings members!
The holiday season is closing in on us! Things to note:
1) For those of you who have the Cycliq Fly12 and/or Fly6 cameras, there is a town hall meeting on Nov 1st at the Castro Valley Library (3600 Nobridge Rd, CV) from 6:30-8:30 pm. This will be a round table discussion regarding the use of video footage and prosecution of suspects in assaults and drivers in accidents, questions and/or issues with the camera systems, etc.
2) The opening of Calaveras Road is once again delayed
3) Starting Nov 17th, a section of Morrison Canyon Rd will be closed to vehicular traffic but open to pedestrian and cyclists (according to an East Bay Times article)

It's that time again to ask for members to take up the role as ride leaders for the rides needing one. I need ride leaders for the following rides:
SUNDAY, 11/26 : Women's Social Ride
MONDAY : MMRR

Will the existing ride leaders please check the calendar for any needed corrections/additions and let me know.

Thanks and ride safe,
Dennis Dong
Ride Coordinator

Re: Morrison Canyon

Andreas Kadavanich

#338

Draft resolution that went to City Council:

Draft Resolution- Morrison Canyon Road Safety Project

This specifies “motorized vehicles” per CVC 415, so assuming the draft was approved without amendment, this excludes bicycles and motorized wheelchairs (and horse-drawn carriages).

“Low speed” (presumably that means class 1 & 2) pedal-assisted electric bicycles are explicitly exempt from the closure as well.

So the sign is wrong, and they really mean motor vehicles. The permanent signs will presumably fix this.

There’s also a map that shows the affected section

Morrison Canyon Road, Area Map and Photo

And yes, CVC 21200 still applies while riding on the closed section.

Show quoted text

On Oct 26, 2018, at 22:01, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

It's true that bicycles (in California) are "devices" rather than vehicles. But at the same time, 21200 says "A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

So if a sign says "no vehicles", is that "applicable" here? That's the ambiguity.

I suspect what they really mean is no *motor* vehicles.

Yeah, it's pedantic, until a police officer issues a ticket to a cyclist for violating 21200.

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 9:35 PM Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:
If the sign says that the roads is closed to “vehicles”, but doesn’t mention bicycles, it’s open to bicycles. Because bicycles aren’t vehicles in California.

That was the original question being asked.

That said, the sign could be wrong. I haven’t read the text of the actual ordinance for the road closure.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 21:07, Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:

I'm not sure what this discussion turned into. Yes, a bicycle is not a motor vehicle, but under CA VC 21200(a), a cyclist has to follow the rules of the road (including stop signs)

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 20:58 Glenn Kirby <gkirby@...> wrote:
They are not Motor Vehicles. Bicycles are regulated in California under the Vehicle Code

On Oct 26, 2018, at 8:47 PM, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

Bicycles are not vehicles.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=670.
This is why municipalities have to explicitly forbid sidewalk riding by ordinance. CVC 21663 does not apply to bicycles.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 13:24, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>

Re: Morrison Canyon

Tony DD

#337

I've heard it for thru traffic, so, cars cannot access this road to get over to 680, due to the increase in cars and for the safety of pedestrians and cyclist??

Show quoted text

On Friday, October 26, 2018, 2:03:20 PM PDT, Glenn Kirby <gkirby@...> wrote:

I think this is happening because of conflicts with bicycles and walkers caused by the recent dramatic increase in commuter traffic being sent up Morrison and Vargas by the GPS tracking systems. Hundreds of cars have been directed over this road in the afternoon commute leading to complaints. Fremont City Council recently declared an unsafe condition on a 2-way road that is only nine feet wide in places. This is an interim step pending more permanent legislation. Closing the road will make it much nicer for people to ride and walk and to get to Vargas Plateau Regional Park.

Glenn Kirby

On Oct 26, 2018, at 1:24 PM, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>

Re: Morrison Canyon

Tony DD

#336

I guess it depends on what and how its posted?

I rode in the zone that was blocked for the Fremont parade and the Fremont PD threatened to give me a ticket saying the street was blocked for all vehicles and stated the bike is a vehicle. This was at the corner of the Stevenson/Paseo Padre by the Fremont library this year.

I was only trying to get home.

Show quoted text

On Friday, October 26, 2018, 9:35:55 PM PDT, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

If the sign says that the roads is closed to “vehicles”, but doesn’t mention bicycles, it’s open to bicycles. Because bicycles aren’t vehicles in California.

That was the original question being asked.

That said, the sign could be wrong. I haven’t read the text of the actual ordinance for the road closure.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 21:07, Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:

I'm not sure what this discussion turned into. Yes, a bicycle is not a motor vehicle, but under CA VC 21200(a), a cyclist has to follow the rules of the road (including stop signs)

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 20:58 Glenn Kirby <gkirby@...> wrote:
They are not Motor Vehicles. Bicycles are regulated in California under the Vehicle Code

On Oct 26, 2018, at 8:47 PM, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

Bicycles are not vehicles.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=670.
This is why municipalities have to explicitly forbid sidewalk riding by ordinance. CVC 21663 does not apply to bicycles.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 13:24, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>

Re: Morrison Canyon

Michael Graff

#335

It's true that bicycles (in California) are "devices" rather than vehicles. But at the same time, 21200 says "A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

So if a sign says "no vehicles", is that "applicable" here? That's the ambiguity.

I suspect what they really mean is no *motor* vehicles.

Yeah, it's pedantic, until a police officer issues a ticket to a cyclist for violating 21200.

Show quoted text

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 9:35 PM Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

If the sign says that the roads is closed to “vehicles”, but doesn’t mention bicycles, it’s open to bicycles. Because bicycles aren’t vehicles in California.

That was the original question being asked.

That said, the sign could be wrong. I haven’t read the text of the actual ordinance for the road closure.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 21:07, Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:

I'm not sure what this discussion turned into. Yes, a bicycle is not a motor vehicle, but under CA VC 21200(a), a cyclist has to follow the rules of the road (including stop signs)

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 20:58 Glenn Kirby <gkirby@...> wrote:
They are not Motor Vehicles. Bicycles are regulated in California under the Vehicle Code

On Oct 26, 2018, at 8:47 PM, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

Bicycles are not vehicles.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=670.
This is why municipalities have to explicitly forbid sidewalk riding by ordinance. CVC 21663 does not apply to bicycles.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 13:24, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>

Re: Morrison Canyon

Cyril Paul

#334

Vinnie,

Thank You!

Cyril

Show quoted text

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 21:49 Vinnie Bacon <vbacon@... wrote:

The closure will be for one year. The City will reassess after that.

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:48 PM Cyril Paul <cpaul78@...> wrote:
Randy,

Is this temporary or forever? I have not been keeping up with this. I am sure I am not alone.

Cyril

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 12:17 Randy Fewel <jailteacher@... wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

--
Vinnie Bacon
e: vbacon@...
p: 510-796-8870

Re: Morrison Canyon

Vinnie Bacon

#333

The closure will be for one year. The City will reassess after that.

Show quoted text

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:48 PM Cyril Paul <cpaul78@...> wrote:

Randy,

Is this temporary or forever? I have not been keeping up with this. I am sure I am not alone.

Cyril

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 12:17 Randy Fewel <jailteacher@... wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

--

Vinnie Bacon

e: vbacon@...

p: 510-796-8870

Re: Morrison Canyon

Vinnie Bacon

#332

I’m embarrassed that I don’t know for sure since I was at the City Council meeting. I don’t recall bikes being discussed. I do remember that the only physical barrier will be a few poles that bikes could easily get through.

I will verify with staff.

Vinnie

Show quoted text

El oct. 26, 2018, a las 21:35, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> escribió:

If the sign says that the roads is closed to “vehicles”, but doesn’t mention bicycles, it’s open to bicycles. Because bicycles aren’t vehicles in California.

That was the original question being asked.

That said, the sign could be wrong. I haven’t read the text of the actual ordinance for the road closure.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 21:07, Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:

I'm not sure what this discussion turned into. Yes, a bicycle is not a motor vehicle, but under CA VC 21200(a), a cyclist has to follow the rules of the road (including stop signs)

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 20:58 Glenn Kirby <gkirby@...> wrote:
They are not Motor Vehicles. Bicycles are regulated in California under the Vehicle Code

On Oct 26, 2018, at 8:47 PM, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

Bicycles are not vehicles.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=670.
This is why municipalities have to explicitly forbid sidewalk riding by ordinance. CVC 21663 does not apply to bicycles.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 13:24, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>

Re: Morrison Canyon

Andreas Kadavanich

#331

If the sign says that the roads is closed to “vehicles”, but doesn’t mention bicycles, it’s open to bicycles. Because bicycles aren’t vehicles in California.

That was the original question being asked.

That said, the sign could be wrong. I haven’t read the text of the actual ordinance for the road closure.

Show quoted text

On Oct 26, 2018, at 21:07, Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...> wrote:

I'm not sure what this discussion turned into. Yes, a bicycle is not a motor vehicle, but under CA VC 21200(a), a cyclist has to follow the rules of the road (including stop signs)

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 20:58 Glenn Kirby <gkirby@...> wrote:
They are not Motor Vehicles. Bicycles are regulated in California under the Vehicle Code

On Oct 26, 2018, at 8:47 PM, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

Bicycles are not vehicles.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=670.
This is why municipalities have to explicitly forbid sidewalk riding by ordinance. CVC 21663 does not apply to bicycles.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 13:24, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>

Re: Morrison Canyon

Andreas Kadavanich

#330

They are regulated by the Vehicle Code (so are pedestrians), but they are not vehicles, since they are “moved exclusively by human power”. (OK, I sometimes get an assist by gravity, but that doesn’t seem to count.)

CVC 670. A “vehicle” is a device by which any person or property may be propelled, moved, or drawn upon a highway, excepting a device moved exclusively by human power or used exclusively upon stationary rails or tracks.

This is why CVC 21200 has to explicitly call out that cyclists have to abide by the same rules as vehicle operators.

Show quoted text

On Oct 26, 2018, at 20:58, Glenn Kirby <gkirby@...> wrote:

They are not Motor Vehicles. Bicycles are regulated in California under the Vehicle Code

On Oct 26, 2018, at 8:47 PM, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

Bicycles are not vehicles.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=670.
This is why municipalities have to explicitly forbid sidewalk riding by ordinance. CVC 21663 does not apply to bicycles.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 13:24, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>

Re: Morrison Canyon

Dennis Dong <ronincopp@...>

#329

I'm not sure what this discussion turned into. Yes, a bicycle is not a motor vehicle, but under CA VC 21200(a), a cyclist has to follow the rules of the road (including stop signs)

Show quoted text

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 20:58 Glenn Kirby <gkirby@...> wrote:

They are not Motor Vehicles. Bicycles are regulated in California under the Vehicle Code

On Oct 26, 2018, at 8:47 PM, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

Bicycles are not vehicles.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=670.
This is why municipalities have to explicitly forbid sidewalk riding by ordinance. CVC 21663 does not apply to bicycles.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 13:24, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>

Re: Morrison Canyon

Glenn Kirby

#328

They are not Motor Vehicles. Bicycles are regulated in California under the Vehicle Code

Show quoted text

On Oct 26, 2018, at 8:47 PM, Andreas Kadavanich <andreas@...> wrote:

Bicycles are not vehicles.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=670.
This is why municipalities have to explicitly forbid sidewalk riding by ordinance. CVC 21663 does not apply to bicycles.

On Oct 26, 2018, at 13:24, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>

Re: Morrison Canyon

Andreas Kadavanich

#327

Bicycles are not vehicles.

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=670.

This is why municipalities have to explicitly forbid sidewalk riding by ordinance. CVC 21663 does not apply to bicycles.

Show quoted text

On Oct 26, 2018, at 13:24, Michael Graff <michael.graff@...> wrote:

Are bicycles treated as vehicles in this case?

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21200.

"A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle..."

Or is the road closed only to *motor* vehicles?

(Nextdoor says "The content you're looking for was posted in another neighborhood.")

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 12:17 PM Randy Fewel <jailteacher@...> wrote:
From my Nextdoor feed:

Yay! It's happening!
Morrison Canyon Road will be closed to vehicles starting November 17th :-)

Randy.

<image1.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg><image2.jpeg>